Kokomo

[John Greenly]

here's a link to a photo, says it's of  Kokomo depot, in the Summit County Library collection.  

https://summit.marmot.org/Record/.b37719889

anybody know what photo this is?  do we have it already posted?  Does somebody live near enough to go take a look?

this library also lists the Hattie Ritchey collection, has a couple of other Kokomo photos:

https://summit.marmot.org/Author/Home?author=%22Hattie%20Ritchey%20Collection.%22

John

[Keith Hayes]

All, I finally got a part that would post to Shapeways:

I thought to make all the windows and doors a single sprue. If this works well, I will go back and make single sprues for Ft. Logan, Dome Rock and Estabrook. My part is due from Shapeways this week. If it looks good, I will post the part in S and O for purchase by others. John has already nicely modified Grandt parts for his use. If there is interest in HO parts, I will see what I need to do to shrink my parts to HO (the window muntins are  1 1/2" square in S, so will go to 2" or larger in HO in order to meet Shapeways material tolerances.

When the time comes to build the building, how far in should I place the gable ends of the roof from the end walls? Got any tips John and Doug?

I have also been working on column bases for my water tank column. I will repost the full columns with bases too. And, I may make a part with the Elk Creek brace at the midpoint of the column. After that...I am not sure what my next 3d print project will be. Any ideas?

So much seems to be going on in the model world just now: Grandt and San Juan have been bought by Leadville Shops; Shinohara has stopped production and I hear Monster Model Works will be going out of business. This last news is especially sad, because the laser cut brick was so nice to work with.

Work and family have kept me busy, but I have managed to get ballast down on most of my track and will start scenic-ing more of Leadville once I have the track clean and operating well again. Mr. Pat Student was in town recently and we had dinner: he has a host of interesting tidbits he has discovered about D&RGW gons--I hope he collects these and posts them in these parts soon. Closer to home, Mr. Trent is hard at work on some new 'coals' for Dickey and will no doubt share his results soon.

[Jim Courtney]

After that...I am not sure what my next 3d print project will be. Any ideas?


Well, you will likely need doors and windows for the Breckenridge depot . . . I have Blazek's plans should you need them.

Then there are those 85 buckets that you'll need for the dredge in Breckenridge!


BTW, are the Estabrook / Ft Logan parts now final (you referred to a glitch to fix), or are you going to do new sets bast on the Kokomo sprue arrangement? Should I hold off purchasing?

[John Greenly]

Keith,

I'm working on getting the best set of roof dimensions for Kokomo that I can.   My second model roof (see post above in this thread) seems to match the available photos well.  The pitch of the outer hipped roof turns out to be exactly 5/12 pitch  so it's very plausible, but the central gabled roof comes out at 8.5/12.  

Here's something I'm wondering about.  The framing square is a very old invention, patented in the early 1800's, and I think it's fair to assume the carpenters would have used one to frame this roof.  But I've never seen one with numbers for fractional pitches like 8.5.  9/12 is definitely too steep, but looking back at the photos again I think it could possibly be 8/12.  So, right now I have a question for any builders in our midst (SP-- what do you think?) about roof pitches.  Is it at all likely that back in those days a roof would have been built to an 8.5/12 pitch?   Or should I go ahead and make a third test roof at 8/12 for the center gable, rework the outer hip to fit, and see how it looks?  

By the way, this basic roof configuration is often referred to as a "Dutch Gable", (EDIT: correctly a "hipped gable", see Chris's post below) but typically the gables are right at the ends of the building and the pitch of the hipped part is equal to the gabled part- no break in the pitch of the long sides.  The Kokomo depot roof was rather unusual, with its gables inset from the ends and the hip pitch reduced, with the hip rafters coming out exactly above the corners of the building.  A very elegant design, to my eye.

your comments welcomed-  hoped for!

thanks
John

ah- by the way, in the Grandt windows I used the muntins are .017-.018", so right about 1.5" in HO.  .  

[Keith Hayes]

Could the roof be a 6:12 pitch?

My Stanley square has all sorts of math stamped into it, some of it being roof pitched. As I recollect, it seems to me that even pitches are more common than odd, so if your hairy eyeball is telling you 5:12, I bet it is really 6:12. That pitch is a LOT easier to figure out than the other. 😎

[Keith Hayes]

The parts arrived!

They look pretty good, but the freight doors may not have rendered as well as I like.

I need to get these home, into a bath and prime them to see what we have to work with. The munitions are quite fine.

[Robert McFarland]

7.62mm or .30-06?

[John Greenly]

...or maybe going to do some explosive forming of parts??

Those windows and doors look beautiful!  I haven't noticed a photo with 4/4 windows, all are 2/2 panes, both early time and late.  Do you have a photo that we haven't seen here?

anyway, Keith,  as to the roof, I talked with a builder friend who does a lot of work on old buildings,  and he thought 3:12 or 5:12  would not be very unusual, though higher odd numbers  are seldom seen.   6:12 for the hip of the roof is definitely too steep.  So I've settled on 5:12 and 8:12 as the very likely correct pitches for hip and gable, and I've worked out the slight changes in dimensions from my earlier 8.5:12 gable.  I'll make up another test roof and then I'll post the final results.  It will look very nearly the same as the second roof I showed (above in the thread)  that Doug thought was good.  

Cheers,
John

[snapped_bolt]

Hi Keith!

    Get a chance to add the rivet detail to the water tank band clamps in 1:48 yet?

    I have a couple of tanks to finish and perhaps sell. I have a neanderthal tank core building method- glue together chunks of balsa and turn them on the lathe. I would be afraid of crushing a hollow-core style. Usually happens right about the time I think I may be dropping it....

   I have enough to worry about with telegraph wire hazards in the scenery. Usually right up front!

       Cheers!

         Stan

[Keith Hayes]

Oh snap.

Jim sent me some plans, and this just goes to show I should have checked the photos. No only does the door not hug ave a transom, but the sash is 2 over 2. Except...one of the bay sashes has 4 lites. Go figure. At least I can snip out the muntins.

And no work on the band straps, either. The single bolt version does have bolt heads, but they did not render.

[John Greenly]

If you look closely at the early photo you'll see that the lower sash has been raised about halfway on that window so it looks like 4 lites above, but it's really 2/2, same as its partner on the bay.  As to the transom,  there is none, and there is the very tall door, in that early photo (the first one on the first page of this thread, posted by Doug Heitcamp)  but in the post-abandonment photo Jim Courtney posted further down that page, there is a transom.  Sometime between the 19-teens and 1940 the door was replaced with a lower one with transom?
John

[Jeff Young]

Huh, I can't believe I never noticed the transom/no transom discrepancy.

In the 1924 picture #71 is hiding the front door.  I have a couple of mid-30's pictures, but they're all of one end or the other.  

The earliest picture I have showing the transom is 1939, but it appears that the door continues behind the transom bar???

[John Greenly]

wow, Jeff, you're right-  the door does appear to go all the way to the top.  So, then, what is that "transom" framing in front of it?  And, for that matter, what is the light-colored vertical board that's attached to the original door frame on the left side that the roof support mounts on?  Looks to me as if at some point a smaller- lower and narrower- door might have been stuck on outside the original door- a screen door, perhaps?   And since the original door was so tall, a transom was stuck in there to fill the gap?  

Good luck!  I'm glad I'm modeling the period of the early photo in the 19teens  where all is clear and simple.  Looks like you really can't go wrong though by just using the original tall, transomless door for any time period.  Although an added screen door with a transom would be a very cool addition to a model, leaving the inner door open to see the interior-  that sounds like something right up your alley, Jeff….

Cheers, and now I can't wait to see your model and Keith's underway-- we'll have a real Kokomo Kollection!
John

[Keith Hayes]

Here are the parts with some primer on them.

I clipped out the extra muntins. Funny thing, there is a print shadow on some of the parts from the part above. I will have to ask Shapeways about this. Now that there is primer on the parts, it is less visible,  but still can be seen. This model will be placed such that you will not be able to see the rear of the building,  so I will be able to hide a couple of the less good prints there.

Overall,  not bad though. The corbels on the bay window eyebrow are neat.

[Keith Hayes]

Construction has commenced!

[Keith Hayes]

Now for the roof!

[Keith Hayes]

Thanks to John, my roof went together quickly.

Now to wait for paint to dry,  then trim, final paint and shingles.

[Chris Walker]

John,

you referred to the roof line as a Dutch gable, on a true Dutch gable the whole peak is clipped off at 45deg.  A Hipped gable is what the Kokomo Depot has.   Best example I can think of a Depot with a Dutch gable roof was at Ouray on the D&RG(W), and the South Platte Depot had the Telegraph Bay Gable in the Dutch Style incongruous with the Hipped gables at either end.

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/12916/rv/singleitem/rec/1

[John Greenly]

Wow, Keith, this looks great!  Now you're way ahead of me with your depot.  Your windows and doors are excellent.
Cheers,
John

[John Greenly]

Chris, thanks for the clarification and correction on the roof names.  That South Platte depot is an odd one, isn't it.

Cheers,
John