C&S Photos on eBay.

[Chris Walker]

Jeff,
I concede the location isn't where I thought on Clear Creek.  All the curves lined up, but then #58 and that covered winch car wasn't used on the Clear Creek scraptrain, of which in my focusing on the peaks, just didn't enter my head at the time.



However try as I might, I just can't reconcile the steepness of that background to the Boreas Pass.

My apologies to the readers.

[Keith Hayes]

Chris, I still cannot believe your incredible grasp of so many Colorado places from half way around the world.

What about near Webster or Grant? The hills and trees look more like Platte Canon.

[Chris Walker]

Keith,  I'm still thinking about this, it's those damned river willows, the depth of the scene, the verticality of the shot.  Not to slight Jeff in this regard, I regard his views as high authority on the C&S.

There is a similar willowed view taken in the Tenmile but I have yet to match that mountain with the Highway views I can get here, the C&S being closer to the canyon walls.
The #58 was used in the Tenmile on her own, #71 I think was on the Platte end, I need to look at that angle further.

In the EBay photo, which quick scans through most of my books hasn't showed up yet, I see that the #58 had been decorated at this time by a bored crewman with white paint or chalk around the Headlight Ring, the lower edge of the Headlight Bracket, the central edge of the front handrail and the Numberplate surround.  To find a picture of #58 showing that whiteing was done prior to withdrawing from Breckenridge is the key to solving this,it isn't visible in the Solitude scrapping photos.

There is the definite possiblity that the view in question was taken around Mayo or Puzzel or even near the Gold Pan, since the Mineral Belt V-II pg132-33 view at Mayo Spur has echos to distract me.  Mal Ferrell has in C&Sng pg192-93 similar views climbing out of the hookeye curve close to the Washington mine, which if at trackside, could yield a view of that Mountain behind Breckenridge that bugs me.  These three scenes mentioned have a heavy concentration of Willows present.

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/2447/rv/singleitem/rec/99


These taken at or near Bacon show the distinct lack of Willows and scene verticality, it has been many years since I journeyed over Boreas now.

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/42216/rec/5


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/42552/rec/6


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/42551/rec/7


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/72069/rec/8


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/42548/rec/1


Happy New Year.....

[Jim Courtney]

Chris,

The Klingers' C&S Platte Canon Memories . . . has a chapter on scrapping operations.

They reference two photographers following 58 with the scrapping train, Dick Kindig and H.R. Griffiths as having followed the train on August 5 and August 21, 1938.

These two photos were in the Ten Mile, near Solitude:



H.R. Griffiths photo.



Richard Kindig photo.


The 58 hasn't been made up with chalk yet.

Then there is this photo, dated to August 21st, east of Breckenridge:





The location is cited as on Boreas, near MP 107. And there's the chalking that you mentioned.

Per the text, C&S 58 was in charge of pulling the actual scrap train. C&S 71 was in charge of switching out the flatcars of rail, when a siding was reached, then hauling a train of rail down to Dome Rock, returning the empties. A C&S crew (the scrap trains were operated by the contractor, likely with laid off C&S engine crews) would haul the rail from Dome Rock into Denver. C&S 70 is shown in several photos hauling rail from Dome Rock to Denver.


Happy New Year to you, too.  You always seem to get a head start on everything!

[ComoDepot]

he trees would be Aspen and Pine.

Seems quite possible that the background could be Borea, would need to be lower on the Breck side.

Andy Anderson worked with his father for the scrapper, he was too young to have worked for the Railroad.

Seems odd that they were working a long way from Como but left Como in September?

[Chris Walker]

Jim Courtney wrote

Then there is this photo, dated to August 21st, east of Breckenridge:
The location is cited as on Boreas, near MP 107. And there's the chalking that you mentioned.

Thanks Jim,  I have since found the EBay pic, Mineral Belt V-II pg96 sepia toned   which also added to my confusion as to where I thought I had seen it.

the photo referenced with the chalking is one of several scattered over several books at that area, of which I'm now certain the EBay photo will belong to....which now begs the question would the locality be known as Bacon, since the line had to hook around Nigger Hill and Rocky Point first.

Looking at the #58 headed upgrade with that peak behind, only the curve above Gold Pan trestle fits since the intervening ridge behind Hookeye isn't high enough.


USGS 1938 Mt Lincoln


See Digerness got the grade and direction wrong, pg131 Min Belt 2.


By the way,  New Years Day is bright sunshine and a light Easterly cooling breeze at 83f  

[Chris Walker]

In a Jan-2015 thread on the Narrow Gauge Discussion Group,  http://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,281318,281363#msg-281363 Martin Hansen posted these two pictures of the #58 on the scraptrain, the most important view showing no Chalk markings at Breckenridge.


R.H Kindig photo Martin E. Hansen Collection

R.H Kindig photo Martin E. Hansen Collection

[South Park]

Otto Perry was awesome, just for doing what he did.  But Kindig and
Griffiths smoked ol' Perry for photo quality and detail/contrast. Too
bad the latter two did not rub that skill off on Otto.  His photos would
be first class.  I'll still give him an "A" for effort.  

It never ceases to amaze me what these NG RR photographists did to
get their pix, given the cars and roads of the day.  Simply mind boggling
to think of driving to anywhere on the NG circle in 1935 !  The drive from
Denver to Breckenridge would have taken all day in GOOD conditions !
Driving to Rico ?  Holy moly !!!  And they made LOTS of these trips !!!  

[ComoDepot]

Well they did not need to deal with the I 70 traffic jam.

[Chris Walker]

Where's the 4WD that is needed to get to Costco thesedays?

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/44111/rec/27

[Fred52]

Hi all!
Otto and his '36 ford never ceases to amaze me. At a time when there were no SUV's or even surplus jeeps that little car did yoemans work.
Fred Cotterell

[ComoDepot]

Sitting between the Depot and Hotel, Costco beckons tomorrow.

PS Very rarely is used in 4 wheel drive and have yet to need chains. But when you need 4 wheel drive you need it.

[John McCutcheon]

Chris

There are chalk marks on tender next to the small sign hanging on the tender

[Chris Walker]

John,
there are views in the DPL of the #58 showing the fake D&RGW herald chalked on, there is also another on the Smokebox door.  These were mentioned in Martin Hansen's NGDF post I linked to in previous posts and my answer to him re whether Kindig did them.

in Klinger's book C&S Highline Memories, pg 16 has a photo taken of two Women in front of #58 with the same chalked Rio Grande herald, in the caption is reference to Kindig stating he never noticed it when it was pointed out to him in 2003.

[Jim Courtney]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Colorado-Southern-Railway-Boreas-Pass-Original-Print-Rocky-Point-Upgrade/352249490211?hash=item5203b4ab23:g:ZkcAAOSwSPBaUmjn



A recent thread raised the question as to whether the C&S narrow gauge ever used super-elevated curves. This vintage view of the curve at Rocky Point seems to be an example. View is looking upgrade.

[ComoDepot]

No wonder there were so many derailments.

[Mike Trent]

?

[Jim Courtney]

Here is another photo, c.1903 at the same spot, looking downgrade:


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Colorado-Southern-Railway-Rocky-Point-Near-Breckenridge-1903-E-Peabody-Photo/232622957324?hash=item362968a30c:g:Qx0AAOSwFO5aUmXw



C&S Brooks 2-6-0 number 21 does seem to lean into the curve a bit . . .

[Chris Walker]

FWIW I have done change-overs on superelevated curves where it was given the slope of the ballast, made me unable to reach the handrails, having to pull myself up by the bottom step to get on the loco, and I'm not that short at 5'8½" either!  

[Jim Courtney]

Two more interesting photos just listed on eBay:


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Central-City-Colorado-Colorado-Southern-Railroad-Depot-Original-Print-J-Cody/352262582726?hash=item52047c71c6:g:UHgAAOSw-RhaZ2fI



An undated photo of "Jimmy Cody" standing in front of the Central City depot at the yard throat. Friend of yours, Rick?



https://www.ebay.com/itm/Colorado-Southern-Railway-Blue-Spruce-Power-Plant-Breckenridge-Colorado/232640800681?hash=item362a78e7a9:g:wK0AAOSw9V1aZ6c0



An E.C. Peabody photo, probably first decade, of the "Blue Spruce Power Plant?", above Breckenridge. Can anyone more clearly locate what we are seeing in the photo??