Mac Poor article-common or rare?

[Kurt Maechner]

I happened on a small publication called "How Come, Why, And How I Wrote 'Denver South Park & Pacific" by Mac C. Poor for roughly 7 dollars on Abe Books.  I just received it today.  It is in a little publication of the June 1965 edition of "The Denver Westerners Monthly Roundup."  

Out of curiosity, is this a well-known document or a rarity?  I certainly had never heard of it before.

On other notes, I have a few new posts that may interest some:
"The Last Train from Alpine Tunnel was in...1915?"

and
"Narrow Gauge Rules the World! No really, it does!"

Enjoy!
Kurt

[Robert McFarland]

Referring to the 1915 Buena Vista article I said  on DSP&P Yahoo Groups "When pigs fly" and "Fake News"

[Keith Hayes]

For a period of ten years, I volunteered with the Friends of the C&TS working on projects in Chama, Cumbres and Antonito (I suggest all modelers do this, as working on the real thing is very instructive). One year I was working in the Chama yard and the train left as usual, followed by the speeder with the fire water. Not that kind of fire water. When you work in Chama, you stop work to watch the train leave. This is almost mandatory as a safety measure as so many of the projects occur close to the main at the north end of the yard.

Anyway, the train left, and work resumed. But...after a bit the radios started to crackle and the rail crews started moving about: the trailer behind the speeder had come loose and was heading down grade! Earl Knoob was in Chama and there was a hot locomotive on the lead. Earl spotted the locomotive on the main about even with the coal tipple. When he saw the trailer coming, he reversed down the track, matching the speed. The trailer gently bumped the pilot and Earl averted a tragedy. The event confirmed a number of lessons for me:

1. Railroading is dangerous, even under the best circumstances.
2. Trains are SILENT. You could barely hear the flanges on the rails as the trailer sailed by.
3. Cool heads prevail.

I was impressed that the loose car had stayed on the rails. I am not sure where it broke loose, but I gather it had traveled multiple miles downgrade. And I can confirm even a moving steam locomotive can be curiously quiet.

I have no doubt a group of folks pushed a trailer up to East Portal for a ride down the grade. What is startling is a fool would tie himself to a rope and jump off to brake the car. More surprising is that he survived to tell the tale.

[Kurt Maechner]

Great story, Keith!  
There's a story from the famous Mark Twain having ridden a push car down from East Portal in 1910 as well.  It can be found in Helmer's Historic Alpine Tunnel book.
Kurt

[Kurt Maechner]

In reference to MacCarry's, the human brake's, situation the text of the 1915 article says, he "fastened to his body a rope which was attached to the car.  Without a moment's hesitation he jumped from the car, hoping that his dragging body would reduce the speed of the car, so the ladies could jump without much damage."  One lady jumped and "sustained a broken collar bone and a badly sprained ankle."  Two others jumped and received sprained ankles.  The article then states, "By this time it was noticed by those remaining on the car that the dragging body of the assayer was acting as a brake....Approximately one mile from where McCarry jumped from the car it came to a standstill.  Wonderful as it may seem, McCarry escaped with only a few slight bruises, a shaking up, and came out of his experience with not even a broken bone."

I've certainly found a good amount of exaggeration in news articles from this time period, so certainly some doubt can be attributed to the details, but the inclusion of so many specific names (McCarry, Rick Hagardane, Miss Worthington, Mr. Swanton, Mrs. C.H. Swanton, Mr. and Mrs. McFarland, and Miss Bonita Cochran) and even some of their occupations seem to suggest this wasn't entirely a fabrication.  

Still, how could a man be dragged along with only bruises as a result?

Also, does anyone know what an "assayer" is?  McCarry is called this twice in the article.
Kurt

[tonyk375]

Hey Keith,  That was always called the S&W break every morning!  Stand & watch.  Missing Chama and think I'm going to start going back for a week or so a year.  Not as nice as when I was two hours away and would work 8 or so weeks a year in the yard.  

[Jeff Young]

An assayer was a chemist employed in the business of determining the amount of precious metals in an ore (usually quote by value, rather than by weight).

[South Park]

I read this story years ago and wondered the same thing.  It never stated how
fast the car was going, but we might assume faster than a man could run.  Bumps
and bruises, huh ?  That was one tough SOB !

When the Milwaukee Road abandoned in May of 1980, we put a track maintenance
flatbed we had made to glide real smoothly on the rails just east of Snoqualmie tunnel
and into the dark we went !  We had another vehicle parked at Cedar Falls and upon
arrival there, drove back up to the summit to retrieve Vehicle No.1.  Piece of cake !

Now, the grade was a tame 2% or less, and we never got going much faster than we
could run, using a brake, fashioned from a 2x4 and a lever point on the car to rub
against the rail.  But 4% down from Alpine tunnel ?  These folks were not very attuned
to railroads and physics !  Yikes !  I wonder how much alcohol was involved ???  

[ComoDepot]

Plenty of photos of non railroad persons on flat cars so I always assumes it was common.

The section crew would also use them, the Section Boss at Boreas a DeLeo was seriously injured c 1918 doing so, the speed was usually controlled by means of a wooden club.

[Rick Steele]

Remember that the rails were in place for a long time after the official abandonment. The D&RGW, after scrapping the branch, only removed the rails from Quartz (where their operating authority ended to Parlins, because even in 1917 the line from Parlins to Gunnison was noted as having rails removed. It obviously didn't take long for the scavengers to hit the right-of-way.

From the stories that I have read and heard (mostly from Helmer's original Alpine Tunnel Book), the county used many of the rails from Quartz to the Tunnel for cattle guards and other purposes. There are stories of much of the Rails and Ties being "Shoved over the side" of the grade to make a road up to the tunnel.

So a speeder ride down from the Tunnel to Pitkin, or even Ohio City would not surprise me.

The Human brake story would work only at very slow speeds. Steel and wood can be very unforgiving. I would imagine that it is an exaggeration unless the man in question decided that the car was going too fast and hopped off the uphill end and attempted to slow down the car using his "Fred Flintstone" brakes.

On a 4% grade you can use a 4x4 as a brake as long as you don't let your speed get too fast. We used to do this on the grade in Central City as a matter of course. We did it at Georgetown ocassionally as well. The tough part was pushing them back up grade at the end of track.

In My opinion a ride on a track car in no way constitutes any sort of train. Just like the "Boreas Zephyr" Model T track car was not a train either, but a vehicle that was owned by a couple of Como Locals who took it for a ride over the unused Boreas Pass line.

Rick

[Kurt Maechner]

I did a bit of research on what happened to the rails to Alpine Tunnel after 1910 and it turns out a man named William Turner was contracted to pull them up.  He pulled the western approach from Quartz to a mile from the tunnel (due to some obstruction) in 1923.  He then pulled the rails from East Portal to Hancock in 1924.  

An article from the the Pitkin Miner newspaper from Nov. 23, 1923,  states, "Wm. Turner, contractor who has been taking up the rail on the old C&S railroad between Quartz and Alpine tunnel, was [in Pitkin] Wednesday for supplies.  The rails are now all up and a few days loading cars will wind up the work.  The contractors came in August 1st and have taken up and delivered at Quartz 650 tons of rails since commencing work.  Eight cars of rails were shipped to the Moffat tunnel and other points; some was scrapped."  -this quote is from Daniel W. Edwards' A Documentary History of the South Park Line: Vol. 5, page 166.

No doubt during those 13 years from 1910 to 1923 some locals got their hands on a few rails, though, most stories I have come across related to this are in reference to the remaining rails from inside the tunnel to about one mile downgrade.  One random rail inside the tunnel was curiously missing as noted by at least one group that got in in the 1990s.

For those curious, I have an article here, previously printed in Bogies and the Loop that looks at why that last stretch of track remained.

Kurt

[Robert McFarland]

The exaggerations are the only reason I was making fun of it.I don't doubt the trip happened

[Kurt Maechner]

Rick, ironically, I never thought about the fact that you have to actually push a push car up the grade first!  Having never had a ride on one, are they heavy?  I can't imagine pushing one of those three miles up a 4% grade from Hancock to Atlantic!

Also, since you mentioned Central City, did you work on one of its reincarnations?
Kurt

[ComoDepot]

I assume they would have towed them up, perhaps using Burro or Motor Car or on the back of a Loco, not sure I have seen any photos of the latter.

[jim pallow]

   There is a photo in the book "Rainbow Route" of a loco pulling a push car.  Another is in the Uintah books. It was far more common than you would suspect.  The G-Town Loop had a 4'x8' 4-wheeler which I (with passengers) took from Plume to the end of track multiple times.  The push car was very heavy although because of the inset axles I could "wheel barrow" the car to the track.  It took very little time to accelerate once on the 4%!  The cart had 4-wheel metal brake shoes. I would not want to be on it fast in a derailment. JP

[Chris Walker]

Nothing like Coasting on the grade.  In my case only about 100ft long; first 40ft 4% steepening to 7.5% 'til the bridge, no brakes!
https://flic.kr/p/pijWqh  That will show you how quickly acceleration takes place.

[South Park]

  Chris,

  You sure do have a lot of funny looking dogs !  

[Rick Steele]

Yes Kurt,

I worked on the Colorado Central Narrow Gauge AND the Georgetown Loop from 1969-1978 when I hired on with Union Pacific in Cheyenne.

Rick

[jim pallow]

Rick isn't lying, I had to put up with him!   JP

[Kurt Maechner]

Hi Rick and Jim,
I've long been fascinated with the Central City line and the goings-on there.  Was it a successful operation generally?  Were there ever plans to rebuild the Packard Gulch trestle and build more track?  Also, was there ever consideration of operating 71 on the Central City line during that time or was operating her first entertained when there was an attempt to move it to Silver Plume?
Just curious!
Kurt