ICC map abbreviations

[Jeff Young]

I've discovered that "D.R." means derail.

The turnouts for the Silica sidings are labelled "P.S.", while the ones for the Jefferson siding appear to be "H.B.".  Presumably these are interchangeable turnout labels standing for points switch and head block, and the surveyor was just too asleep to notice that the Silica turnouts were in fact stub switches?

After the Jefferson siding there are 3 more I can't work out:
  24" x 24" W Box - 16'
  12" x 18" W Box - 16'
  12" x 12" W Box - 16'

The graphic for each appears to cross the tracks.  Box culverts, perhaps?

Cheers,
Jeff.

[Jeff Young]

In Kokomo there are abbreviations “P.C.” and “P.T.”, each with a circle on the track.  Any ideas?

(Oh, and in Kokomo there’s also 12” x 12” Wood Box - 10’, so I think the Jefferson “W Box” annotations are the same, and are for wood box culverts.)

Jeff.

On 13 May 2015, at 13:51, Jeff Young [via C&Sn3 Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

I've discovered that "D.R." means derail.

The turnouts for the Silica sidings are labelled "P.S.", while the ones for the Jefferson siding appear to be "H.B.".  Presumably these are interchangeable turnout labels standing for points switch and head block, and the surveyor was just too asleep to notice that the Silica turnouts were in fact stub switches?

After the Jefferson siding there are 3 more I can't work out:
  24" x 24" W Box - 16'
  12" x 18" W Box - 16'
  12" x 12" W Box - 16'

The graphic for each appears to cross the tracks.  Box culverts, perhaps?

Cheers,
Jeff.

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[Rick Steele]

The Items that you describe are just that, box culverts. If they were corrugated pipe, they would read "corr. i pipe".

You usually only find the PT and PC and PCC on the main line tracks:

They stand for:

Point of Tangency
Point of Curvature
Point of Compound Curvature.

If you look closely at the map, you will see where these lie in terms of feet and inches from the 0.0 measuring point. For Example, all of the Clear Creek 3' gauge lines were measured from Golden, not Denver. You will see the notation on the main line of  "0" through, in some cases "1300" or more. If you do the math with the milepost locations, you will see that they are generally around 5,280 feet, although I have seen some that subtract out to 7,000 and some less. Generally this is because there was a line change or some sort of relocation.

Inside of the curve you will see a triangle and that will give you the degrees and minutes of the curve. The notations on the P.C. or P.C.C. will give you the length of the legs of the triangle.

PS stands for Point of Switch.

The surveyors took notes and then drew the notes up in Denver. On the field notes it also notes what kind of ties there are on any particular track (Pine, Oak, Hardwood) their condition and the number. The field notes also note what kind of rail, year, weight and manufacturer and how much wear to calculate the cost of the rail. Remember, this was all about taxation.

HB stands for Heel Block, not Head Block. All turnouts have Heel Blocks.

Rick

[Jeff Young]

Thanks, Rick!

I didn’t know what a Heel Block was, but I found this document which explains all the basics of railroad track: <a href="http://www.engsoc.org/~josh/AREMA/chapter3 - Basic Track.pdf" class="">http://www.engsoc.org/~josh/AREMA/chapter3%20-%20Basic%20Track.pdf.  (It’s modern, so it doesn’t help for things that have changed since narrow gauge days, but a lot of it’s the same.)

Cheers,

Jeff.

[Chris Walker]

Some good close-up views of Stub turnout Headblocks  can be seen in Bob Richardson photos taken at Rico.  DPL search for RGS Narrow Gauge Views such as this one http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/75637/rec/82

Just where are these ICC maps that you mention, in a certain book or online?

[Chris Walker]

Just in case you thought that I was losing it I thought I'd better post this excerpt from the NZRailways General Code Of Railway Practice.

"Head block (points). A pair of sleepers used to support the switch-point operating mechanism and the Points Lever, or support the electric Points Motor in remotely controlled installations."
"Head rod. The throw rod nearest the point of a switch, usually placed between the two head block sleepers."
"Heel block (points). A block which spans joints and fills the space between adjacent rails at the heel of a switch, joined with outside splice bars by continuous bolts to form a unit joint.
"Heel length. Distance between the heel end and half-inch point of a frog, measured along gauge line."
"Heel of frog. The end of a frog farthest from the switch."
"Heel of switch. The end of a point blade farthest from the point of switch."
"Heel spread (frog). Distance between gauge line at the heel end of a frog."
"Heel spread (points). The distance between the gauge line at the heel of the point blades."

Heel Blocks are at the heel of the point blades between the running and diverging rails.  This location would be the Headblock on a Stub switch.  Problem is definitions in the wording between our two countries and the obsolescence of the stub down here.
Just a bit difficult to overcome 38 years of Rule Book terminology. :)

[Jeff Young]

In mulling this over my conclusion was that the head and heel blocks for a stub switch were the adjacent ties on either side of the point of switch.  (The head block holds the switching mechanism; the heel block holds the stationary ends of the tracks to be switched to.)

Jeff.

[Chris Walker]

Should be one and the same on a Stub. In as much as there is no toe and heel of a pointblade here.
Note that there is a steel bottom plate to which is rivited a stop and an arched plate that is notched to secure the running and diverging rails of the switch proper. Some of these were really butch castings.  The stub ended running rails are free to slide as far as the stops.

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/75637/rv/singleitem/rec/65

I'll try to find a better illustration if you want.

[Jeff Young]

Interesting; I didn’t realise the arch plate and the bottom plate would be spiked down to the same sleeper.  Makes sense, though, as it would obviously keep it’s alignment better that way.

[Robert McFarland]

There is a good photo of a stub switch north of the Como Roundhouse in Chapter 9 "Along the Line" of the DSP&P Pictorial.The original page is 298. Photo credits are DPL so its a wonder that it isn't on the Digital site yet.

[Jeff Young]

Thanks Robert.  The DSP&P Pictorial picture makes it much clearer that there’s a single baseplate for both the leading rail slide limiters and the trailing rail clamps.

The left-hand side of Chris’ picture also looks like a single baseplate, but the right-hand side doesn’t, causing me to misread it.

Cheers,
Jeff.

[Jeff Young]

... which reminds me, I should go through DSP&P + Pictorial Supplement looking for box culverts too....

[Robert McFarland]

Check out the stub switch and harp stand at Bakerville/Graymont in DPL photo Z-2566.

[Jeff Young]

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/66245/rec/1

Interesting that straight-through is a vertical target.  Was that typical?  (I always thought a two way switch would use right and left, but I'm not sure where that idea came from....)

Jeff.

[Robert McFarland]

Or walk the east approach to Alpine Tunnel from Hancock to the East Portal.

[Chris Walker]

American Stub Switch Illustrations and Description.  

I suggest you hard copy this information as I have seen this particular resource disappear from the internet at least twice since I have been building fullsized trackwork for my Tramway and the local Park railway.

http://www.catskillarchive.com/rrextra/tkwk10.Html

Headblock design drawing is in here.

http://www.catskillarchive.com/rrextra/tkwk530.Html

[Chris Walker]

Jeff,
check out this picture of Idaho, shows the Harpstand Lever orientation for Mainline stubs and note how the crossover in the centre is positioned.
http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll21/id/9818/rv/singleitem

[Jeff Young]

In my (not terribly fruitful) search of the Pictorial Supplement for box culvert pictures, I did run across at least 20 pictures of harp stands in the vertical position.  (One or two of them might have been 3-ways, but the rest were clearly not.)

I'm not sure how I got the wrong end of that stick, but wrong end it appears to be.

Cheers,
Jeff.

[Chris Walker]

Jeff Young wrote

I'm not sure how I got the wrong end of that stick, but wrong end it appears to be.

Cheers,
Jeff.

Hehe we are all guilty of that at one time or another.  After looking for these pictures I noticed just how much scrap the C&S trackage was.  They weren't shy on saving on joinerbolts, that's for sure.

Don't forget to hammer down your railends

More for you to chew on....Individual plates are known as Chairs (Buda Track Catalog).  Some are cast complete, others fabricated with punched stops or riveted stops and forged keeper straps riveted on.  


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/44078/rv/singleitem/rec/1


http://cdm16079.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/44057/rv/singleitem/rec/367


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/2481/rv/singleitem/rec/1

[Robert McFarland]

You might try Historic Alpine Tunnel by Dow Helmers(soft cover edition)