D&RG Map Leadville 1883

[Jimmy Blouch]

Almost 5 years ago I posted a series of D&RG station maps along 10 Mile Canyon.
Since that time I have kept in mind that Jim Courtney asked about a Leadville map.
Well, finally here is one.  It is similar to the series of maps Chris Walker posted October 2016
I decided to start a new topic since Leadville was/is not part of 10 Mile Canyon.
I am not sure how well these views will appear.
They are from a map, ink on canvass, which measures over 10 feet long and almost 5 feet wide.  Does not quite fit on my scanner.
So I tried a few views with my iphone.  They leave a lot to be desired.
I have other Leadville maps but they are not readily accessible.

Jimmy

Map title and Eilers

White streaks are sun light

[Jim Courtney]

Wow, was it almost 5 years ago that you did the Ten Mile branch maps??!!!

I consider that to be one of the all time best threads on the Forum: http://c-sng-discussion-forum.41377.n7.nabble.com/Ten-Mile-Stations-of-the-D-amp-RG-td6164.html

Thank you so much for posting the Leadville map. Obviously, it precedes the South Park's arrival in Leadville via the high line. But in 1883 the "Tripartite Agreement" was still in effect, so the South Park was dispatching trains to Leadville via Buena Vista and the D&RG line up the Arkansas River valley, correct?? South Park passenger trains would have used the D&RG station, while freights also used the yards.  All locomotives would have been serviced at the D&RG's roundhouse.

I recall a photo after the fire of the D&RG roundhouse, with locomotives of both roads damaged -- diamond stacks and Congdon stacks in the same ruined facility.

A challenge: Anyone have any photos of South Park trains between Buena Vista and Leadville on D&RG rails?  How about South Park locomotives or trains in Leadville using D&RG facilities -- not burnt, I mean?

[Dave Eggleston]

Farrell's South Park book has a photo from Ted Kiercey's collection on page 46 that is apparently a D&RG train with following DSP&P train (engine sure looks to have a Congdon stack) along the Arkansas.

I'm also wondering if the photos of Granite in Digerness' V1 show any South Park cars. The reproduction isn't really clear on that, I can only make out D&RG on a few cars.

[Robert McFarland]

Theres a photo of a mixture of DSP&P and D&RG  freight cars in Leadville in one of the BOGIES & LOOP issues

[Robert McFarland]

Also I believe there is one at the station at Alpine[later Fisher[

[Jim Courtney]

I think you are correct, Robert.

The plan for Jay Gould's "Joint Operating Agreement" was to avoid unnecessary competing construction. The South Park was to use the D&RG line from Buena Vista to reach Leadville. The D&RG was to use the South Parks line, under construction, via the Alpine tunnel to have access to Gunnison. The photo you reference reflects D&RG use of the South Park up Chalk Creek canon.

But since Gould only acquired a half interest in the D&RG, when that road again became an independent line, General Palmer went his own way. And Gould unloaded his interest in the South Park to the UP. The rest is history.

Would make an interesting "what-if" scenario -- Both DSP&P and D&RG trains operating through Alpine Tunnel to reach Gunnison.

[Dave Eggleston]

What a nightmare the D&RG avoided by their sneaky tactics! Running both lines through the tunnel would've quickly proved exciting to us but miserably constrained for the companies involved.

I think a layout based on the joint operation from Buena Vista to Alpine section could be quite fun, both for modeling and for operation. I have no idea what Alpine's trackage was at this time aside from photographic teases of a possible 3-track yard, like seen at Granite.

I've seen a couple of timetables for the joint operation period though only showing the line from Buena Vista to Leadville. But the Official Railway Guides give some idea of Chalk Creek's passenger traffic during this period. The first is the D&RG July 1881 entry, the second the DSP&P entry at the same time. A lot of passenger trains operating on this trackage!



At this time, July 1881, the D&RG was almost in to Gunnison on its own line. As far as I can tell the D&RG never operated trains past Alpine.

[South Park]

  If I were to hold these maps close to my chest, close my eyes, and click
my heels together three times, softly repeating "There's no place like Leadville",
will it take me back to 1883 Leadville ?

What if I say "Pretty please ?"  

[Robert McFarland]

Garo's-shows you why its Garos and not Garo

[Dave Eggleston]

Variations in spelling at that time are interesting, and sometimes confounding! I wonder how many names were modified by the printer who didn't have a clue?

Some esoterica surface in the ORG timetables for Chalk Creek traffic. These points are based on data that could, in fact, be erroneous--who knows how accurate the ORG was? Anyway, it looks like:

The D&RG stopped at Hortense but does not list Heywood's, while the South Park stopped at Heywood's but does not list Hortense. Poor shows these as being 1/2 mile apart, but were they really one and the same location all along, just reported with different names?

The D&RG lists Cascade as a stop while the South Park doesn't.

[note:1883 and 1884 DSP&P employee timetables show Hortense (not Heywood's) and Cascade as stations; it sure would be interesting to know what an 1881 timetable says on this compared to the ORG.]

Plotting out the 10 daily trains, South Park and D&RG passenger trains passed at Cascade in the morning and at Hortense in the early evening.

Based on the earliest departure and latest arrival times, South Park engines appear to not have overnighted at Alpine--but D&RG engines apparently did.

Visiting Alpine in 1881 would've been magic.



 

[Robert McFarland]

There are several photos of Heywood Springs 1 shows a Mason Bogie powered train passing the  Heywood Springs depot 2 Shows the town with the depot at the edge There is another showing one of the ex U&N  Consolidations and  one showing the DSP&P 42 powered photo train.Hortense is the one with the Brooks  Mogul