A question for you??

[Gerard]

Afternoon everyone

I know this doesn't really have anything to do with the C&S.

But I figure someone here could steer me to what I'm looking for.

I'm looking for architectural drawings of building along the SP Owens Valley RR.
Or at least a good book about the line.

Regards,

Jerry

[Jim Courtney]

Jerry,

The best overview of the SP's Owens Valley line is Ferrell's Southern Pacific Narrow Gauge:

https://www.amazon.com/Southern-Pacific-Narrow-Mallory-Ferrell/dp/B0006E9QGE/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=Southern+Pacific+narrow+gauge&qid=1583781186&s=books&sr=1-1

The original book on the line was Turner's Slim Rails Through the Sand (also available on Amazon). IMHO it has much less info for the money.

I'm not sure about structure drawings on either book.

There are recently quite a few photos for sale on eBay of SP narrow gauge subjects:

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=Southern+Pacific+SP+narrow+gauge&_sacat=35975&LH_TitleDesc=1&_sop=10&_odkw=colorado&_osacat=35975

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1311.R1.TR2.TRC0.A0.H0.XCarson+%26+colorado+.TRS0&_nkw=carson+colorado+railroad&_sacat=35975&LH_TitleDesc=1&_sop=10&_odkw=colorado&_osacat=35975


I don't know if you are contemplating model railroading based on the SP narrow gauge, but as an Sn3 enthusiast, you should consider PBL's rolling stock kits in Sn3:


 

On the back cover of this months NG&SL Gazette, PBL has announced a new SP kit, the modified Perlite boxcars:




PBL also sells separate SP specific freight trucks, molded plastic detail parts and their Star brand of SP "Sun Burnt Red" paint for painting SP freight cars (good for any scale).

A few years back, PBL imported painted, brass models of SP combine cabooses 400 and 401.

Motive power is always and issue, but a few years ago, PBL imported 150 models of the SP ten-wheelers, 50 each of #8, #9 and # 18:





The brass models are long sold out, but show up from time to time on eBay, or sometimes PBL has them on consignment sale.

More info on modeling the SP in Sn3 is here: https://www.p-b-l.com/
You can always call Keren at PBL for more info, and availability of specific models.

Modeling a desert narrow gauge in any scale has its advantages (no need for all those conifer trees), but I still prefer Colorado!

Hope I didn't post information overload, but you did ask!

[Jim Courtney]

I've checked my NG&SL Gazette index, and there are very few SP narrow gauge plans, almost all locomotive or rolling stock.

Plans for the A-frame turntable at Laws and Owenyo were published in the Nov/Dec 1989 issue of the Gazette.

Plans of the Keeler single stall engine house by Herman Darr were published in the February 2001 issue of Railroad Model Craftsman.

The best bet for Espee narrow gauge structure plans Mike Blazek. He offers drawings for both the Laws and Keeler depots, as well as several other out buildings located at Keeler.

http://blazeksplan.com/

[Gerard]

Thanks for the info Jim.

I have a couple of the P-B-L box cars.

Do you know if the SP ran any other places besides Owens Valley???

Jerry

[Robert McFarland]

There  was a series in RMC back in the early 1960s-plans and construction articles for building SPNG cars.This guy even milled his own lumber.I believe the man's name was Ulrich B.Graff.He modeled in On3.

[Bill Uffelman]

His standard gauge line was 17/64" vs 1/4" scale. In one article he implied that he was building the NG to the larger scale too.

Ahh the good old days!

Bill Uffelman

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On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 10:00 AM, Robert McFarland [via C&Sng Discussion Forum]

<[hidden email]> wrote:

There  was a series in RMC back in the early 1960s-plans and construction articles for building SPNG cars.This guy even milled his own lumber.I believe the man's name was Ulrich B.Graff.He modeled in On3.

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[Ken Martin]

The original road was the Carson and Colorado which ran from Mound House outside Carson City to Keeler. They were sold to the SP which converted the line from Mound House to Mina, NV to SG. The narrow gauge ran from Mina to Keeler until the late 30's when they abandoned the line from Mina to Laws. They then shipped out via a SG connection at Owenyo.

The best book on the later line is "SP's Slim Princess in the Sunset 1940-1960" by Joe Dale Morris.
THE book on equipment is "Southern Pacific Narrow Gauge Locomotives and Freight Equipment 1880-1960" by Robert A. Bader.
Neither has plans on structures.
Classic Miniatures and HSM both did a kit of the Laws Depot (still standing). Not sure of other kits.

There is a museum at Laws with Engine 9 and several cars as well as the Death Valley Brill car (working).
The Carson and Colorado Historical Society has restored SP 18 to operation and is starting a museum at Independence, CA.
https://carsoncolorado.com

Ken Martin

>Do you know if the SP ran any other places besides Owens Valley???
>
>Jerry

[Jim Courtney]

Here is a map to illustrate Ken's post:




Mina, NV was the dual gauge division point, with large rectangular engine house, transfer platforms and depot.

Trains southbound from Mina had to cross Mt Montgomery pass (with tunnel at summit) to cross the CA-NV state line and reach the Owens valley; they were often double or triple headed:










The narrow gauge SP trains seem to be mixed trains with combines on the rear, rather than cabooses.




Before the Mina - Laws segment was abandoned there was a lot more diversity in motive power and rolling stock.  Locomotives and freight cars from the N-C-O and former F&CC boxcars were in common use. A former DSP&P business car was stationed at Mina.

Mountain desert railroading seems more appealing to me than the rather flat line of the Owens valley.

Some interesting SPNG links:

http://www.owensvalleyhistory.com/carson_n_colorado/page50b.html

http://www.owensvalleyhistory.com/laws/page103.html

http://www.owensvalleyhistory.com/keeler/page71.html

http://www.owensvalleyhistory.com/carson_n_colorado/page50c.html


Finally, to get us at least back to Colorado (if not "& Southern"), SP number 18 was restored to operation by the Durango & Silverton shop forces at Durango. Before returning to the Owens Valley, SP 18 made some break in runs on the Silverton branch last February, in the snow, with a typical Espee mixed train.

YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6nqsc7CKDE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-SZL0Vpozk

And finally, back in Laws, under steam:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AA8Htd-uosg