Flat top water tanks

[Todd A Ferguson]

Very nice Keith!

I suspect that it was just an inexpensive way to replace roofs as the originals wore out and needed major repairs.  We all know how the railroads hated to spend money on anything, especially on lines that they wanted to eliminate.  The RGS didn’t do anything to their Ridgway water tank when the roof burned off in 1941 I believe.  It soldiered on another 12 years roofless...

Todd

[ComoDepot]

I had incorrectly assumed that flat top meant they were relatively flat not completely flat.

It would make sense to have a slight grade to shed water, I doubt in practice the snow load would cause much of an issue.

I always wondered how long they lasted, plenty of pictures of them encased in ice which could not have helped much for their integrity.

The Roundhouse tank in Como , seems to have been 3/4. One may had its one sides taken off, can not tell from the photos and of course the last one was only here for 2 years.

Seems a long time to survive in a harsh environment.

[Todd A Ferguson]

I wonder if they had any support framing under those flat roofs myself.  Personally I suspect not.  That is probably why they used 3” thick boards.  Those would be fairly rigid in up to 20’ lengths, especially if they were tongue and groove.  But I suspect they were not tongue and grooved either.  

The only load that they would have to support would be a man gaining access or snow.  And if snow became a concern I’m sure they could hire somebody to push it off with a shovel for a very low cost or have an employee do it.  The sun would quickly dry up any rain water that didn’t drain into the tank.  I think the sun beating down on it would be the hardest attack.  We’re the roofs painted?  That would provide some protection from the elements.

Todd

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On Feb 14, 2021, at 5:59 PM, ComoDepot [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 I had incorrectly assumed that flat top meant they were relatively flat not completely flat.

It would make sense to have a slight grade to shed water, I doubt in practice the snow load would cause much of an issue.

I always wondered how long they lasted, plenty of pictures of them encased in ice which could not have helped much for their integrity.

The Roundhouse tank in Como , seems to have been 3/4. One may had its one sides taken off, can not tell from the photos and of course the last one was only here for 2 years.

Seems a long time to survive in a harsh environment.

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[Mike Trent]

Hi, Mike. I'm surprised in scanning the replies to your post that no one seems to have mentioned that the flat roof tanks on the C&S have actually been thought to have been the original conical roofed tanks from DSP&P days. When the old roofs deteriorated, they were simply removed. D&RG tanks were also built with the flat sub roof, but they continued to replace the top roofs as needed.

I doubt we can unearth much detail from the old photos, but surely the B&B crews replaced the old tops several times, and they would have done so as economically as possible.

Ages ago, I talked Joe Crea into building five of the 30,000 gallon tanks for my old layout in Boulder. He had made drawings of the Baker tank which can probably still be found in an old "Slim Gauge News" issue, which predated the "Gazette".

I still have two of those tanks. Both of them have simple 3x12 plank roofs with a single hatch. The original flat sub roofs also had an access hatch under the top roof.

So, use the principle of Occam's Razor, and have at it. You'll be fine. Keith's roofs look spot on.

I'll post pics of the two roofs I have later. I may even be able to find a copy of Joe's drawing...

[John Greenly]

I like Mike's practical viewpoint.  Seems to me that the only reasons for a roof at all are to keep unwanted things from falling in, and in cold weather to retard freezing.  Neither seems to require a tightly sealed or rain-shedding structure,  unless maybe in an environment
where  a lot of dust would settle on a leaky roof and then get washed into the tank by rainwater? Similarly,  paint would seem to be a possible liability,  it would eventually flake off and get washed into the tank.  

Anyway, this is a timely discussion,  I've been cogitating about building a tank lately myself.  Thanks!

John

[Todd A Ferguson]

I’m not sure a few flakes of paint in thousands or tens of thousands of gallons of water would matter at all.  The question of painted flat roof or unpainted is interesting.  I think painted would be the smartest thing, but we all know how much railroads hated to spend money too.  Maybe others can share their opinion or photos suggesting one way or the other...

Todd

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On Feb 16, 2021, at 11:06 AM, John Greenly [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 I like Mike's practical viewpoint.  Seems to me that the only reasons for a roof at all are to keep unwanted things from falling in, and in cold weather to retard freezing.  Neither seems to require a tightly sealed or rain-shedding structure,  unless maybe in an environment
where  a lot of dust would settle on a leaky roof and then get washed into the tank by rainwater? Similarly,  paint would seem to be a possible liability,  it would eventually flake off and get washed into the tank.  

Anyway, this is a timely discussion,  I've been cogitating about building a tank lately myself.  Thanks!

John

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[Mike McKenzie]

Thanks Mike, I looked thru my Slim Gauge News and couldn't find it (may have missed it). On the plus side, I got to look thru all my old Slim Gauge News again! Started getting those in high school starting with the second or third issue. I left the hobby for some 35 years and my SGN (and the early Gazettes) were one of the few things I kept besides my copy of Silver San Juan and CRRM annuals #8 and #12. My wife came across the box containing the SGNs and almost threw them out. I'm glad she didn't cause I kinda like her.

I agree Keith's tanks look good so wouldn't go wrong following his work. By the way, I use an Occam's Razor for cutting bass wood, really the simplest tool out there...



Progress on the PBL kit. I have the motor and sound accessory and the flat roof shouldn't impact that, though I may not animate the valve lever, and just have the valve line hanging loose next to the spout.

Mike

[Jeff Young]

Here's the top of my Jefferson tank:



(I put the top hatch on the "correct" side, forgetting that my Jefferson scene was a mirror image....)

[Todd A Ferguson]

Very nice Jeff!

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On Feb 17, 2021, at 11:49 AM, Jeff Young [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 Here's the top of my Jefferson tank:



(I put the top hatch on the "correct" side, forgetting that my Jefferson scene was a mirror image....)

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[Mike McKenzie]

Wonderful modeling as usual Jeff.

Mike

[Mike Trent]

Hi, Two pairs of pics:

[Mike Trent]

Here's a little tank detail for you. This is the water gauge plate from the C&S tank at Ara, Colorado, East of Boulder. Joe used this as a guide for two or three of the tanks. One of them is included. The plate is cut from sheet iron,  measures about 10" square, with about a 6" tongue.. It's a C&S detail, so, what  the heck?

I can't find my copy of Joe's drawing from the Slim Gauge News. I believe he also published it in his long  ago book, "Structures of the Early West", which also included his drawing of the Coaling Dock at Pine Grove. I'll write him and see if he can't get us a copy of the Baker Tank to post here.  

[Mike McKenzie]

That's a very cool detail, may have to use that.

My Monday work night Mudhen module buddy may have that book, but we haven't gotten together for a couple months. Should start again soon.

Mike

[Todd A Ferguson]

Very nice, Mike!

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On Feb 18, 2021, at 4:09 PM, Mike Trent [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 Hi, Two pairs of pics:

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NAML