Re: Eight wheel Caboose on C&Sng?

Posted by Jim Courtney on
URL: http://c-sng-discussion-forum.254.s1.nabble.com/Eight-wheel-Caboose-on-C-Sng-tp488p1922.html

A very helpful response, indeed, Derrell!

First, the photo--amazing!!  I had intuited that the C&S would have applied the small block monogram centered between the windows of 303 / 1002, and planned to letter my c1909 car as such. Well, I will center the lettering on my car; doesn't look like the C&S car painters used a ruler when they lettered 1002 after renumbering!!

Seems like a common thread with the application of the lettering:  The long bodied rebuilds (1000, 1003, 1009) had the small block monogram and lettering centered (kinda) between the single side window and the far end of the car, the short bodied rebuilds like 1007 (and presumably 1005, 1006, and 1008) had the small block monogram spread out, with the small block "C" and the "S" symmetrically at the ends of the car sides, outside the single window and the "&" centered, with some un-rebuilt cars (ie the 313 in Blackhawk) having the large block C&S applied in a similar manner; finally the small block monogram on the 1002 was an attempt at centering that missed!

The information that you also provided in the text sure helps: "other than to refer back to the 1903 roster where 303 was 14' 6" long inside, 306 was 12' 6" inside and 310 was 12' 4" inside".  It means that the 303 was a long body car before the 1908 rebuilding program started.  Could be, in 1908 or 1909, that the car body of 303 was deemed in good enough shape and already roomy enough that the Master Car Builder decided not to waste time and money relocating the cupola to the end and the only changes were to the underframe, with the application of new intermediate sills, new cast journal pedestals (with the little cast "C&S") and updated brake cylinder and rigging.

I'm pretty much decided to re-detail the 303 body to similar to that of the 306 photo of 1901, that you posted on another thread: Early straight ladders, 4-board running boards with short end overhang, corner cupola diagonal braces over lateral roof walks that were next to the cupola. But I will use the upgraded (Overland) frame, assuming that the 303 was one of the first cars shopped in 1908-1909.  That would mean that the later ladders with ring tops and relocated lateral roof walks to the ends would have been added to the car sometime later, say 1911-12, just before the repainting / lettering as in the photo above.

Of course, the other possibility (that would rain on my planned parade), was that the 303 was one of the last cars reworked in the 1908 rebuilding program--Folio 27 shows 306 / 1005 and 310 / 1008 still had center cupolas as of 1911-1912 but already had the relocated and ring topped ladders, an impressive detail for a folio drawing.  

So, Chris, if you have that firmly dated June 1909 photo of caboose 303 with the not yet rebuilt underframe, please post it now, before I commit myself to brass and solder and paint and decals!

Derrell, thanks again for all the great information!