Ph1 Coal Car lookalike on the F&CC.
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Re:Stakes; Tall.
 
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Re: Ph1 Coal Car lookalike on the F&CC.
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In reply to this post by Jim Courtney
I am using Derrell's drawings for my dimensions, so I've got that going for me...
Jim, to your point about the double taper - if it's your imagination then it may be mine as well and I'd have to agree. In your second image it looks like the near-end side stake (what?) looks tapered while the others are straight, though that may be an illusion. These cars, much like any car (especially narrow gauge), underwent repairs and rebuilds and became unique unto themselves. If we want to build a half dozen, we're likely to miss a few details particular to each car. Oh well... Here's a photo of 4360, from the 4246-4407 series built in 1902, all the stakes appear square (straight) and the u-bolt plates appear narrower and the same length, except the plate on the stake at the far left which appears a touch wider, perhaps from another car.  Some of the stakes have extra bolt holes suggesting re-purposed stakes or narrower replacement upper side boards. A few of the u-bolt plates appear to have a highlight suggesting they were bent to fit a taper at one point, then pounded straight. Am I putting too fine a point on it? It's one of the things about this hobby (and this forum) that really appeals to me, this examination of minutia in the interest of historical accuracy. I love it! And a detail about the original 4090 photo that I just noticed this morning... the end grab iron - how it is bolted to the end stake and wraps around the corner and attaches to the side. Most likely an unremarkable detail, but I just noticed it and find it remarkably cool. I guess my point is: if I'm to make 3d models of these stakes, which do I make? Mike McKenzie |
Re: Ph1 Coal Car lookalike on the F&CC.
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This post was updated on .
Mike,
In answer to your question: "I guess my point is: if I'm to make 3d models of these stakes, which do I make?" I guess we Sn3 modelers need to step up and vote. I know of only one modeler who works in c1900 C&S in Sn3 and that is Bill Meredith at The Leadville Shops. Only two of us, Darrell Poole and myself, build c1909-1910 models of the C&S. (To be honest, Derrell actually builds models; I seem to just collect plans, parts and photos and then think about building models.  ).
Folks like Darel and Keith work in the 1930s. Per Derrell's notes on his plans, the end stakes on the St Charles coal cars were removed prior to 1907 (perhaps when the cars were converted to automatic couplers, c1903-1904). Folks modeling post-1925, probably shouldn't have any cars of this class on their layouts, as most of these cars (90) were sold to A. T. Herr Supply Co. in May of 1925, for salvage of parts or resale. My take is that you should design and print sets of side stakes for both classes of coal cars, the 1899 St Charles cars and the 1902 ASF cars (Derrell has produced plans for both). The lettering sets for both early classes of cars are available from The Leadville Shops. I would purchase five sets of stakes (including the end stakes) for the 1899 St Charles cars. I would purchase six sets of stakes for the 1902 ASF cars. Since these cars were rebuilt with 4" square stakes over the years, accurate models likely would require complete sets of both tapered and square stakes, allowing the modeler to follow photos of a particular car. Once drawn, the sets could also be scaled to On3 or HOn3 if modelers in those scales have interest. One other point, perhaps a mounting pin should be included on the back of the stakes, where they mount to the side sills, so the modeler could lay out mounting holes for construction. Perhaps if sets of stakes for both classes of C&S coal cars were available, The Leadville Shops would consider collaborating and produce laser cut wood components for the frame, floor and sides-ends. The wooden bodies of both classes of C&S 4 board coal cars were near identical in dimensions. Dr. Stears, what do you say??
Jim Courtney
Poulsbo, WA |
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In reply to this post by Chris Walker
Hi Men,
Here is a picture of an On3 model of a C&S 1898 St. Charles coal car, as built. The model was built 12-15 years ago based on Derrell Poole's coal car plans drawn in 1988. The jig to the right of the car was used to taper the stakes uniformly. Cheers, Randy 
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In reply to this post by Keith Hayes
Please Keith, revisit your copy of ngPictV-8 and recheck those pictures. Also visit the wonderful photo's in Mal's C&Sng. You'll be surprised, a lot of Ph-1's had mixed straight and tapered stakes: look along the top-board for the thickness to determine this. I think I see #4307 on the ramp at Como having the most tapered (5/6) I've seen to note. PS Darel, talking of PH-1's......I haven't forgotten 
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand |
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