Is the C&S Phase III SUF Boxcar the most needed car in On3

[Todd A Ferguson]

It seems to me this is the case for anyone modeling the C&S in On3 post 1910.  Given that the C&S had twice as many boxcars as gondolas and as time went by the SUF cars were used more and probably even a higher percentage of the fleet, especially boxcars.

We have this car available in HO and S scale, but it is a kitbash at best today in O scale.  It is interesting that the reefer, stock and gondola SUF cars have been done multiple times in O scale but not the boxcar.  Seems like an opportunity to me...

And even the RGS modelers can use som SUF boxcars in O scale too...

Todd

[nickgully]

https://wisemanmodelservices.com/On3-On30-CandS-STEEL-UNDERFRAME-BOX-CAR-KIT

Isn't this Wiseman kit Phase III SUF?

-Nick Gully

[Jim Courtney]

I be confused, Todd.  Do you model the C&S in Sn3 or On3??

[Paul R.]

Or maybe both? Paul R.

[Todd A Ferguson]

I was not aware of that kit from Wiseman.  I do have 2 of their SUF refrigerator cars though.  Maybe it is a newer kit.

Todd

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On Feb 17, 2021, at 9:43 PM, nickgully [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 https://wisemanmodelservices.com/On3-On30-CandS-STEEL-UNDERFRAME-BOX-CAR-KIT

Isn't this Wiseman kit Phase III SUF?

-Nick Gully

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NAML

[Todd A Ferguson]

I have a few C&S cars in Sn3 and a couple building kits. I model the RGS in Sn3 circa fall 1940 so you end up with some C&S boxcars and stock cars.  I used to have an Sn3 number 60 but sold it about 13 years ago.  I have a couple On3 C&S locomotives and probably 15 cars, a few built and most still kits.  Also a few O scale buildings. So I guess the answer is both...

Todd

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On Feb 17, 2021, at 9:56 PM, Jim Courtney [via C&Sng Discussion Forum] <[hidden email]> wrote:

 I be confused, Todd.  Do you model the C&S in Sn3 or On3??

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[Todd A Ferguson]

Another SUF car question, were they built with the brake gear arrangement as in the former Grandt Line underframe?  Or were they later upgraded to newer brake gear when other safety appliances were added?

The wood sides on the Wiseman kit might be an advantage if one wanted model an as built car body.  Assuming of course the grab iron holes are not laser cut too...

Todd

[Jim Courtney]

As far as original brake rigging, I believe it was the same as in later years with one exception.

The outside chain roller system for the hand brake rod-->chain-->hand brake staff was not original. Erection drawings for the SUF reefer show that the original hand brake rod ran just below the intermediate sill and connected to the lower hand brake staff bracket by a short piece of chain; the hand brake lower staff bracket was originally located outboard relative to the end centerline. The change to the outside chain hanger arrangement seems to have occurred in the mid to late teens, perhaps when USSA appliances were installed.



Near Blackhawk, c.1912. Notice how far to the left of the end centerline the original brake staff is mounted.




The 1907 boxcars had this out-board brake staff arrangement when built. Plans for the 1908, phase two coal cars, in the Narrow Gauge Pictorial also show this outboard arrangement.

Derrell Poole's Sn3 models of the SUF reefers, c.1910 also reflect this arrangement:

http://coloradosouthern.blogspot.com/2014/02/c-refrigerator-cars-part-four.html



By 1920, all brake staffs had moved toward the center of the end, up against the coupler buffer blocks. The St Charles and the 1900 to 1902 built cars always had this arrangement, the brake staff actually passing thru the wood buffer block. The phase 1 boxcars of 1907 reverted to a similar arrangement. But all of the phase 2 and phase 3 SUF cars adopted the outside chain roller arrangement.

The original hand brake rod location was just above the wheel treads of the B end truck. A falling hand brake rod would likely be a derailment danger. (Hand brake chains do break -- I had a bad experience as a brakeman with a runaway car when a hand brake chain broke, on a car with the air bled off). By moving the hand brake rod inboard (phase 1 cars) or outboard (phase 2 and 3 cars), presumably this danger was minimized. At least that is my interpretation . . .

[Jeff Young]

The angled icicles on #8324 are just begging to be modelled....

[John Greenly]

Jeff Young wrote

The angled icicles on #8324 are just begging to be modelled....

Yes!  I wonder, has anyone ever done a C&S snowy winter layout scene?  

Cheers,
John

[Doug Tagsold]

Yes, I did an article on how I made this winter scene that appeared in the Feb. 2021 issue of Model Railroader magazine.
Doug Tagsold

[Jeff Young]

Very nice, Doug!

[Paul R.]

Excellent article in MR as usual. Paul R.

[SteveG]

Thanks, Jim, for posting that photo of 8234--I hadn't realized the SUF cars were originally built with the horizontal end brace, but in looking closer at post-USSA photos of those boxcars, you can see that many still had the corner bracket that had a hole for the brace rod. I'd guess that both the brace rod and the initial placement of the brake staff were removed/moved to provide a clear path for the set of USSA end rungs for roof access.
Steve Guty
Lakeway, TX